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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Wed Jun 25, 2003 8:45 pm |
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Hi, I just bought a audi 90 quattro build 1986
the car looks and drives nice altough its got 275000km on the odometer
but what i want to know is if it is possible to fit an S2-20v/turbo 230bhp engine and what tuning needs to be done to get the engine deliver 400-500bhp?
thx andre |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Fri Jun 27, 2003 4:34 pm |
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nobody? |
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womble
Camped on the site
Joined: Jan 30, 2003
Posts: 383
Location: cardigan,west wales
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Posted:
Fri Jun 27, 2003 9:17 pm |
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Anything is possible,it just depends on how much money you want to spend.If you are looking for that sort of power its going to cost ,big time! |
_________________ lord of the rings |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Sat Jun 28, 2003 12:25 pm |
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Yes well,
i don't want advice on the costs, just wanted to know the mods possible and if the B3 engine fits the enginebay.
But this forum isn't being used by some daihard enthusiast i guess...
have look @ this forum
http://forums.eis.net.au/index.php
I'm curently building a daihatsu GTti with mods to exceed 200bhp (just 993cc turbo) and the audi 4x4 will be my next project.
some mods in my mind:
T03/04 hybrid
282degrees cams hgh lift
mahle pistons with lowered compression rate (7.
large IC
autronic ecu
custom made throttlebody, fuel rail and manifold
550cc injectors
8 puck paddle clutch
sodium filled exhaust valves
and 4" straight trough exhaust |
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Locomotion
UltraUser
Joined: Jan 21, 2003
Posts: 4230
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 9:04 am |
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Sounds like you know what you`re doing already and dont need our help |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 9:11 am |
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Yes i prob do, but i only wanted to if the 20v engine bolts straight in and i was currious about the mods you guy's doing.
just being nice though
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Locomotion
UltraUser
Joined: Jan 21, 2003
Posts: 4230
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 9:24 am |
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I would imagine you need the subframe from the doner vehicle. |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 11:38 am |
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gavs20v
UltraUser
Joined: Jan 30, 2003
Posts: 1743
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 11:54 am |
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Course itll phyiscally it! What model is it as 1986 was the changeover year. Either way the 20vturbo motor was fitted to the later urQ and the later s2 and the phyisical characteristics of the engine bays stay the same all the way through the model ranges. Do you want the 6-speed box as well ? if so this will require the transmission tunnel to be modified. Maybe if you were a bit more specific with your requirements you mayget a response
Gav |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 3:41 pm |
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its this model
build 1986
2.2 N/A engine
The 6-speed would be nice, but 5 will do I don't if the 5 speed I have now will be strong enough to handle the power deliverd by the 3B engine.
cheers |
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gavs20v
UltraUser
Joined: Jan 30, 2003
Posts: 1743
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 3:49 pm |
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Have you already bought the engine? If not try and get the later ABY engine as these put out a few more horses to begin with and are far more reliable. The weak point will be the box with big power. If like you say money is not a factor then go for the 6-speed everytime. Basically youll be buildimg a 20v urquattro using 90q shell therefore all the ur suspension etc will fit.
Gav
If youre serious about this conversion give Tim at centralvwaudi a ring and have a chat with him. Hell be able to carry out the conversion and i cannot rate him or his workmanship highly enough |
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gavs20v
UltraUser
Joined: Jan 30, 2003
Posts: 1743
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 3:57 pm |
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Very horney 90 by the way! Check the red one on the project cars on this link * http://www.audiquattroparts.com/
Anybody know where you can get the clear front indicators same as the ones on the blue one above
Gav |
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cq20v
Site ADMIN
Joined: Jan 20, 2003
Posts: 13250
Location: West Midlands
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 8:51 pm |
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Hmmm, not sure about the straight fit. Reading about the S2, Audi had Konrad Schmitt motrsport help them get the 20V turbo motor intot he Coupe body. Think it was more to do with finding space for the intercooler without having a long inlet track (too much lag).
Engine may go in but for 400bhp you will need the RS2 intercooler at least which is bigger than the standard S2 one.
As already stated, if money no abject, has to be the 6 speed box for reliability |
_________________ 2007 Skoda Fabia vRS SE
1995 80 quattro Sold, died, sold
1994 80 \"Project Titan\" - Now deceased
1993 S2 Coupe - Sold (gutted)
1989 CQ20V - Sold
1986 Coupe GT - Deceased
1985 Coupe GT - Deceased |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 9:20 pm |
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Ok guy's thx,
I read some people use the porsche 944 IC fitted flat at the bottum behind the grille, i also noticed there is some space in front of the radiator.
The 6speed is the one out of the RS2 or are all 6-speed's the same apart from ratio's perhaps?
BTW nice red car gavs
cheers
here is the link to the site the pic came from
http://www.audi-limits.de |
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cq20v
Site ADMIN
Joined: Jan 20, 2003
Posts: 13250
Location: West Midlands
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Posted:
Sun Jun 29, 2003 10:14 pm |
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The 6 speed box was in the RS2 but was also in the ABY engined S2 Coupe's and avants. Not sure if they changed the ratio's for the RS2 though |
_________________ 2007 Skoda Fabia vRS SE
1995 80 quattro Sold, died, sold
1994 80 \"Project Titan\" - Now deceased
1993 S2 Coupe - Sold (gutted)
1989 CQ20V - Sold
1986 Coupe GT - Deceased
1985 Coupe GT - Deceased |
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bluequattro
Camped on the site
Joined: Feb 10, 2003
Posts: 282
Location: stoke on trent
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Posted:
Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:16 pm |
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how about using the v6 from a corrado? should fit the bay and they can be turbo or supercharged, seen golfs with 400 hp motos in them-dubsport do the conversions, dont know a price but thinking of it for mine as an alternative to ur engine. any thoughts? |
_________________ 1986 quattro coupe ( wide arch) 20 valve turbo
1985 coupe gt
99 dsicovery TD5 |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Thu Jul 03, 2003 9:38 pm |
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Quote: | how about using the v6 from a corrado? |
Quote: | REAL Audi's have 5 cylinders !
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audioc
Site OWNER
Joined: Jan 17, 2003
Posts: 12502
Location: E Bay?
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Posted:
Thu Jul 03, 2003 9:57 pm |
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bluequattro
Camped on the site
Joined: Feb 10, 2003
Posts: 282
Location: stoke on trent
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Posted:
Thu Jul 03, 2003 10:18 pm |
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don t care how many cylinders they have as long as they go fast! 29 audi cylinders available to me although not all in one car ( yet!). |
_________________ 1986 quattro coupe ( wide arch) 20 valve turbo
1985 coupe gt
99 dsicovery TD5 |
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audioc
Site OWNER
Joined: Jan 17, 2003
Posts: 12502
Location: E Bay?
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Posted:
Thu Jul 03, 2003 10:19 pm |
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OK,
reading through the previous posts.
As I understand it (and proven wrong in the past, many times!) the 5 speed box in the S2 is the weak point- increase the torque, break the box. I also understand that the casings on the 6 speed box (RS2 in particular) can be kinda weak. What was meant by that when I was told, I don't know.
As for serius tuning, there are serveral options; "homegrown" as well as the speciliat tuners.......
As far as my memory recollects, the UK tuners are not a patch on the EU ones. Most notable, from my dim and distant memory, for the 5 pot engines (not the new gutless 1.8T "wonders"- a 5 pot has Balls!!) you need to look out for:
SMS, Nothelle, Abt (but they probably do nothing much for these now), MTM, Oettinger, or go to Sweden- Dahlback. They do the dogs danglies of all engines in a mk4 Golf... IMSA 90 based.... nice.- www.audituning.com
It's not just hp that counts.... look for reliability, availability of parts and torque. Then HP. Common mod was increase the swept volume of the 2.2/ 2.3 to 2.5 or 2.6- a 5 cylinder diesel block was popular for this, coupled to larger valves, hybrid blower, lower compression, uprated internals, including balanced x drilled crank, uprated oil pump (dry sump?), different cam shaft (Schrick are popular)- Dahlback do a 428 hp (315 kW) vid 5650 r/min; 405 lb-ft vid 2900 r/min engine- full dyno info on their website (Swedish and English!)- although at 18,000 EURO's plus VAT, it may be a little expensive, but hey, it's got S1 bits! Then there's another version AFTER that...... all depends on how much you want to spend. A popular mod over here for S2 owners is to take the S2 later engine as Gav said, and up the output to over 315bhp- RS2 spec. The guys at Dialynx have good experiences of this. (And all 5 cylinder bits)
Don't rule out the newer engines. OK, I think the 1.8T is gutless, if not smooth and tuneable unit. But what about the V8 from the A8, or better still, from the S8. Sapce WOULD be a problem, but the NEW V8 engine (not long since released) is shorter. As is the V6.... a couple of blowers, and you're well into R8 (Bentley? LOL) territory.....
You could possibly pick up an already tweaked engine from a thrashed car- Germany is full of them....... and if you're from NL, do you know either Hugo from the Coupe Club NL, or Carlo Brugman from the Audi Club NL? I owe Carlo a beer......
Let us know how you get on, and what you think....... |
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eeikel
Newbie
Joined: Jun 25, 2003
Posts: 11
Location: NL
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Posted:
Fri Jul 04, 2003 12:04 pm |
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hi audioc, nice reply
I'm using the car as a daily driver for now, but investigating all possible options to restor/tune my car in the future. I'm not loaded with cash to do evrything i want, but its useless to spend alot of money on an expensive engine wich cant run great bhp reliable without an alot of extra money spended.
I think the best route is:
littlebit cheap 3B 20v/turbo engine (2226cc / compratio=9.3/81,0x86,4mm/'89/91 build)
use (mahle?)pistons of the turbo 10v (2226cc /compratio=7.8/81,0x86,4mm/'86/89 build)
cheap 5-speed gearbox, if it breaks change the gearwheels (change ratio?) with bigger stronger ones and new seals,gaskets etc.
If you run through the spec's of the audi 5cil engine you see that audi used smaller bore's for the turbo engine's then for the N/A ones this has prob to do with thinner water ways a point of care so to speak...
remember : fuel = boost = more fuel = more boost etc
trying to keep this violent,massive controlled explosion inside the engine with breaking it and finally unleash it at the wheels
Quote: | .... That's art ........ |
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